[Ovmsdev] OVMS - HW

Thu Jun 26 16:44:03 HKT 2014

I found the data sheet for  the relays, and it seems like they come in 3,5,6,9,12,24,48 V versions. (http://www.hobbytronics.co.uk/datasheets/songle-12v-relay.pdf).

The relay on my module is marked as SRD-05VDC-SL-C meaning the coil should be driven by +5V.

Question1

If I get a relay module with 12V coils can I use the +12V pin on the 9X2 header (OVMS) module as a source for 12V? Any fuses I can risk blowing?

Question2

Instead of soldering wires directly to the 9x2 header on the OVMS, is the any other way to connect wires? I’m thinking about something similar to the connector (pins) used to connect the PIC programmer to the OVMS?

Regards

Olav 

From: ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk [mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk] On Behalf Of Mastro Gippo
Sent: 26. juni 2014 09:21
To: OVMS Developers
Subject: Re: [Ovmsdev] OVMS - HW

Be careful and read the relay code, dx ones seem to be 5v as mine, while fasttech one is 12v. I  don't have the relay now, but you should have no problem supplying it from the secondary connector, just don't feed it back to the ovms. The board already provides optocouplers and mosfets to drive the relay,  so you should just need to pull signals to ground.
Regards
MG

On 26 Jun 2014 02:43, "Mark Webb-Johnson" <mark at webb-johnson.net <mailto:mark at webb-johnson.net> > wrote:

This may help:

http://www.hobbytronics.co.uk/8-channel-relay-board

Seems similar and suggests you put 12V on VCC and that the green jumper is to isolate signal ground from power ground. In OVMS case, the two grounds are the same so it shouldn't matter.

Regards, Mark.

On 26 Jun, 2014, at 8:36 am, Mark Webb-Johnson <mark at webb-johnson.net <mailto:mark at webb-johnson.net> > wrote:

You need a datasheet, or trace the wiring.

Seems to be fasttech have the same board slightly cheaper:

http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/10000007/1144100-ac-dc-2-channel-relay-module

and the reviews there say that the relay side must be powered by 12V. There is a jumper on the board.

If you don't have datasheet, perhaps best is to trace the circuit (it is not complex). Best would be for you to power the opto-isolator side from 5V OVMS, and the relays from 12V direct.

Regards, Mark.

On 26 Jun, 2014, at 8:06 am, Olav A. Antonsen <olav at ansit.no <mailto:olav at ansit.no> > wrote:

Found the answer to one of my questions...

The relays pins are active low.

 <http://arduino-info.wikispaces.com/ArduinoPower#OI> http://arduino-info.wikispaces.com/ArduinoPower#OI

Fra:  <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk [ <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk] På vegne av Olav A. Antonsen
Sendt: 26. juni 2014 01:55
Til: 'OVMS Developers'
Emne: Re: [Ovmsdev] OVMS - HW

The 7805 gets too hot to touch when running with only one relay closed, so I definitely need to add an external source to the relay module.  I'm assuming I can connect the external power source to the 3-pin connector using the JDVcc and Gnd pins?

Does anyone know if it needs to be +5V? Can I supply the relay board  with 12V?

Another thing I don't understand is the fact that when the OVMS output port i low (0) the relay closes. When I set the output port to 1 the relay opens.

Looking at the closeup of the relay module, do I need to supply the Vcc pin with +5V on the 4-pin connector?

Regards,

Olav

Fra:  <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk [ <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk] På vegne av Thomas Bergo
Sendt: 18. juni 2014 04:16
Til: OVMS Developers
Emne: Re: [Ovmsdev] OVMS - HW

Hi Olav 

Why don't do it easy and use a MOSFET and a 12V relay. Then you don't need to worry about heat and 5V power consumption.

See attached picture sample circuit. You should probably also add a resistor from the output of the PIC to GND to make sure the relay is turn properly off.

Regards, Thomas 

2014-06-17 10:04 GMT+02:00 Olav A. Antonsen < <mailto:olav at ansit.no> olav at ansit.no>:

Seems like most car phone chargers uses a MC34063 switchmode-regulator chip that is much more efficient than a 7805. Will strip one out of its casing and give it a try.

For stronger currents I was told to use a UBEC.

--Olav

From:  <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk [mailto: <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk] On Behalf Of Mastro Gippo
Sent: 17. juni 2014 09:38

To: OVMS Developers
Subject: Re: [Ovmsdev] OVMS - HW

Olav, the temperature should not raise that much, as the PCB is dissipating some of the heat. You can just try it and see if it heats up too much (being careful not to blow the fuse, as Mark said), or use your own 7805 slapped to a small heatsink. If you need more power, a car phone charger may be a better choice as it has a more efficient switching supply.

MG

2014-06-17 8:44 GMT+02:00 Olav A. Antonsen < <mailto:olav at ansit.no> olav at ansit.no>:

100°C/W!  9V * 0.2A = 1.8W => I need to keep the relays closed for 1 hour so it’s going to overheat!

Need to find another solution for feeding the relay module with +5V.

Mastro, any suggestions?

--Olav

From:  <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk [mailto: <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk] On Behalf Of Mastro Gippo
Sent: 17. juni 2014 00:33
To: OVMS Developers
Subject: Re: [Ovmsdev] OVMS - HW

Hi, this is the correct DS:  <http://www.st.com/web/en/resource/technical/document/datasheet/CD00000444.pdf> http://www.st.com/web/en/resource/technical/document/datasheet/CD00000444.pdf

for the DPAK package the OVMS is using, you have 8°C/W for the TJ and 100°C/W for TA. (it's a small package!)

Also, you must calc the dissipation thinking about the "dissipated" voltage, so not 5V but (14V-5V) = 9V (worst case).

You should also add some margin, e.g. use 100mA instead of 80mA just to be safe.

Just try it and keep a finger on the IC for a few minutes to see if it overheats, it shouldn't hurt the board.

MG

2014-06-17 0:14 GMT+02:00 Olav A. Antonsen < <mailto:olav at ansit.no> olav at ansit.no>:

Great video thermal design.

My knowledge on thermal design is only 30 minutes old, but my interpretation of the datasheet gives med

The regulator will reach 23°C/W above ambient.

Running at max 1.5A @ 5V =  7.5W.

23C/W => 172.5°C -> To hot to handle

2 relays @ 80mA each ~ 0.16A @ 5V ~ 0,8W ~ 18.4°C above ambient.

My conclusion is that adding a consumption of 160mA will raise the temperature 18.4°C above ambient. (This comes in addition to the current the OVMS module consumes.

)

Is this correct?

Regards

Olav

Fra:  <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk [mailto: <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk] På vegne av Mastro Gippo
Sendt: 16. juni 2014 23:38

Til: OVMS Developers
Emne: Re: [Ovmsdev] OVMS - HW

The 1.5A is not the whole story; you can watch this:  <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ruFVmxf0zs> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ruFVmxf0zs

Basically, if you had that 7805 on free air powering your two relays, it would (try to) reach about 170°C above ambient temperature. The PCB is a nice heatsink, but it is shared with the big GSM regulator, and that rises the temperature too.

By all means, experiment!! The 7805 has thermal protection, and you should test your circuit on the bench keeping a finger on the IC to feel if it gets too hot.

You should take care of the increased ripple too, but a small cap should do the trick there.

Regards

MG

2014-06-16 23:09 GMT+02:00 Olav A. Antonsen < <mailto:olav at ansit.no> olav at ansit.no>:

I got some help from a user on a Norwegian forum who pointed me to

 <https://raw.githubusercontent.com/openvehicles/Open-Vehicle-Monitoring-System/master/vehicle/Car%20Module/v2-base/OVMS_V6A.pdf> https://raw.githubusercontent.com/openvehicles/Open-Vehicle-Monitoring-System/master/vehicle/Car%20Module/v2-base/OVMS_V6A.pdf

Looks like a 7805-regulator is supplying the OVMS module with +5V @ 1.5A max.

 <https://www.sparkfun.com/datasheets/Components/LM7805.pdf> https://www.sparkfun.com/datasheets/Components/LM7805.pdf

80mA won't be a problem then.

--Olav

Fra:  <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk [mailto: <mailto:ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk> ovmsdev-bounces at lists.teslaclub.hk] På vegne av Mastro Gippo
Sendt: 16. juni 2014 23:03
Til: OVMS Developers
Emne: Re: [Ovmsdev] OVMS - HW

It may be a problem to get the 5V from the output of the regulator, but the nice thing about that module is that it is isolated; you can connect your own power supply and be 100% safe. These relays draw about 80mA each (just tested them, I have the same product at home), so if you turn them on one at a time and for short periods of time it should be ok (I don't know a lot about the termal design of the OVMS).

MG

2014-06-16 22:37 GMT+02:00 Olav A. Antonsen < <mailto:olav at ansit.no> olav at ansit.no>:

Hello

My knowledge of electronics is limited.

As far as I understand the OVMS module is supplied with +12V via the OBD connector. What I don't understand is where the +5V comes from?

 <https://github.com/openvehicles/Open-Vehicle-Monitoring-System/blob/master/vehicle/Car%20Module/v2-base/20120814-boarddesign.pdf> https://github.com/openvehicles/Open-Vehicle-Monitoring-System/blob/master/vehicle/Car%20Module/v2-base/20120814-boarddesign.pdf

I'm currently trying to control a relay using the RC3 output on the PIC18F2580 as a control signal to a rely on a relay module

 <http://www.dx.com/p/arduino-2-channel-relay-shield-module-red-144140#.U59Qavl_t8E> http://www.dx.com/p/arduino-2-channel-relay-shield-module-red-144140#.U59Qavl_t8E.

The relay module needs to be supplied with +5V to drive the relays, and my plan was to get the +5V from the OVMS module using pin 13 on the HEADER 9X2.

But I'm afraid I might blow something on the OVMS module if the relay module draws to many mA.

Any advice would be appreciated.

--Olav

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